Make Ahead
Whole Grain Sourdough Rye Bread
Popular on Food52
7 Reviews
Cindy
February 20, 2021
Hi, I am about to mix things together. I could only get rye berries and my spice grinder would not crack them, it turned some to powder and left some whole. Now they do not seem soft enough to go into the final dough. They are already mixed with the cornmeal, quinoa, and oatmeal. What would you suggest? Should I try to cook the mash more by steaming it using the water for the recipe? Cook another set of rye berries in my pressure cooker separately and add them to additional ingredients and just toss this other mash to my chickens? This recipe was posted so long ago that you may not notice this in my time frame. I am excited to finish this bread.
Cindy
February 20, 2021
In the end I started a new batch of mash with fully cooked rye berries, added them to carefully calculated amount less of water, plus oatmeal and cornmeal.
This was not a dough, this was a very thick pasty batter. I found that when it was time to get it into the bread pan I was trying to fold it a little bit to make a loaf shape and it was impossible. I had to pretty much lift it, drop it, then smooth it into the bread pan. I wish that I had done the bulk ferment in the bread pan because there seems to be no reason to do it in a separate container—unless you need to move it form container to counter to pan to compress some air out. I think I have seen some other breads of this type that explicitly state that they are more of a batter.
It fermented well so we will see what happens as it retards and rises in the pan.
A video would be helpful.
This was not a dough, this was a very thick pasty batter. I found that when it was time to get it into the bread pan I was trying to fold it a little bit to make a loaf shape and it was impossible. I had to pretty much lift it, drop it, then smooth it into the bread pan. I wish that I had done the bulk ferment in the bread pan because there seems to be no reason to do it in a separate container—unless you need to move it form container to counter to pan to compress some air out. I think I have seen some other breads of this type that explicitly state that they are more of a batter.
It fermented well so we will see what happens as it retards and rises in the pan.
A video would be helpful.
Stephanie B.
February 21, 2021
Hi Cindy, some of my rye berries pass through my mill whole and soften just fine in the final bread (same when I used a spice grinder in the past). I’ve also done whole oat groats and they softened well too-next time I may try whole rye berries because I liked the texture of the whole oats so much. The mash should hydrate overnight without having to cook the grains, though I’ve seen plenty of recipes with cooked grains added.
Hmm you may have a point on fermenting all in the pan, I’ll have to give that a try! I just ferment in the bowl I used for mixing since it’s already covered in dough.
I can’t comment on the hydration of your dough, sorry! For me it always forms a dough, albeit a wet and sticky dough, but I wouldn’t call it a batter (I can turn my bowl upside down and the dough won’t fall out for example). I recommend holding back some of the water when mixing the final dough and if it doesn’t feel like it needs more water, no need to add it all. Flours absorb water differently so I always find hydration to have some flexibility in breads. Also is it possible the cooked grains added to the hydration?
I agree videos are nice! But as I’m a private citizen so to speak (not a food professional and working full time) I’m not sure I have it in me to make and edit a video. I hope the loaves turn out for you!
Hmm you may have a point on fermenting all in the pan, I’ll have to give that a try! I just ferment in the bowl I used for mixing since it’s already covered in dough.
I can’t comment on the hydration of your dough, sorry! For me it always forms a dough, albeit a wet and sticky dough, but I wouldn’t call it a batter (I can turn my bowl upside down and the dough won’t fall out for example). I recommend holding back some of the water when mixing the final dough and if it doesn’t feel like it needs more water, no need to add it all. Flours absorb water differently so I always find hydration to have some flexibility in breads. Also is it possible the cooked grains added to the hydration?
I agree videos are nice! But as I’m a private citizen so to speak (not a food professional and working full time) I’m not sure I have it in me to make and edit a video. I hope the loaves turn out for you!
Cindy
February 21, 2021
Hi, thanks for your response. The dough, true, would not have spilled out of the bowl. I have worked with 100% hydration rye/wheat and also a Volkornbrot dough. Never a rye this soft and airy on the counter. I only used oil on the counter, not wanting to get unmixed rye flour into the dough. If you can’t comment much on hydration, not knowing our flour differences, can we talk about dough texture? When mixing, I used a Danish dough whisk (with the wire shaped like the @ sign), and it was moderately easy to whisk. When you take it out of the bowl after mix time, you say you can ball and oil it. I could not pick up the dough. I had to scrape it out, push it into a round with a two scrapers, scraping dough off each scraper with the other, and then oil the top, scrape it upside down and oil the bottom, then scrape the mass into an oiled bucket. When you form the loaf, does the dough feel like a very sticky drop biscuit or dumpling dough? Super airy and soft?
What kind of flour do you use? I use organic Champlain Valley dark rye I get wholesale. The reason I am so curious about this is that my other rye recipes come out very hydrated.
What kind of flour do you use? I use organic Champlain Valley dark rye I get wholesale. The reason I am so curious about this is that my other rye recipes come out very hydrated.
Stephanie B.
February 21, 2021
I sprinkle my counter with flour (rye or wheat) and since its patted into shape and not handled much I find I don't get lines of flour or dry bits in the bread.
I use my hands or a wooden spoon to mix, I haven’t used a danish whisk but I’m assuming they’re sturdier than ball whisks? I don’t think I’d have an easy time mixing this dough with a whisk unless it was a strong whisk! After mixing (and the first ferment) the dough is very sticky and shaggy, maybe more like thick drop biscuit dough. I used to use a bowl scraper to scrape onto the counter, oiled the bowl and my hands, picked up dough with my hands, and rolled it around in the oiled bowl to ferment. Now I just mix and leave in the bowl without any oil, either way I use a bowl scraper to loosen the dough from the bowl before dividing. The dough is soft and airy, but I divide with a bench scraper and I’m able to use flour and my hands to pat/form into loaves and pick up by hand to place in loaf tins. I’m not saying my hands are completely free of dough, but I can handle the dough.
When I wrote this I used hodgson’s (spelling?) mill because that’s about the only thing grocery stores carried. Now I use a Mockmill to mill organic rye berries. The store brand was a coarser rye flour so I tried to mill a similar texture. When I tried a finer grind I found I was more likely to get a “starch bomb” texture. When you say your other recipes come out very hydrated do you mean they’re less soft/airy or more batter like? I’m sorry this dough gave you so much trouble! If you care to share a few recipes you’re referring to, I’d love to check them out!
I use my hands or a wooden spoon to mix, I haven’t used a danish whisk but I’m assuming they’re sturdier than ball whisks? I don’t think I’d have an easy time mixing this dough with a whisk unless it was a strong whisk! After mixing (and the first ferment) the dough is very sticky and shaggy, maybe more like thick drop biscuit dough. I used to use a bowl scraper to scrape onto the counter, oiled the bowl and my hands, picked up dough with my hands, and rolled it around in the oiled bowl to ferment. Now I just mix and leave in the bowl without any oil, either way I use a bowl scraper to loosen the dough from the bowl before dividing. The dough is soft and airy, but I divide with a bench scraper and I’m able to use flour and my hands to pat/form into loaves and pick up by hand to place in loaf tins. I’m not saying my hands are completely free of dough, but I can handle the dough.
When I wrote this I used hodgson’s (spelling?) mill because that’s about the only thing grocery stores carried. Now I use a Mockmill to mill organic rye berries. The store brand was a coarser rye flour so I tried to mill a similar texture. When I tried a finer grind I found I was more likely to get a “starch bomb” texture. When you say your other recipes come out very hydrated do you mean they’re less soft/airy or more batter like? I’m sorry this dough gave you so much trouble! If you care to share a few recipes you’re referring to, I’d love to check them out!
Elise S.
November 18, 2019
I made this bread and it turned super tasty and really good. I made a few changes but otherwise, once you are used to making 100% rye bread, this bread will not be too much trouble. When making the mash, I simply boiled the rye berries with cracked rye for about 10 minutes and took into account the water I used. I decided to using rye flakes instead of oat flakes. And I didn't use the cornmeal, only millet flour to replace it. I also didn't use the cocoa powder. I have not added cocoa to any of my rye breads yet, as I like the taste and colour as is.
I added the following spices: 1 tbsp each dried orange zest, fennel seed, anise seed, caraway seed, cardamom. The spices were not that strong after all, so I might add a little more next time.
I also added ¼ cup veg oil into the dough once it was formed and ready to cover with plastic.
Lastly, to simplify, I didn't use my hands in the dough as it gets really sticky and I don't want to waste any dough. It was just as good to stir it with a wooden spoon and to scoop it into two parchment lined pans for the final rise.
I added the following spices: 1 tbsp each dried orange zest, fennel seed, anise seed, caraway seed, cardamom. The spices were not that strong after all, so I might add a little more next time.
I also added ¼ cup veg oil into the dough once it was formed and ready to cover with plastic.
Lastly, to simplify, I didn't use my hands in the dough as it gets really sticky and I don't want to waste any dough. It was just as good to stir it with a wooden spoon and to scoop it into two parchment lined pans for the final rise.
Stephanie B.
November 18, 2019
I'm absolutely thrilled you like it! The couple recipes I've posted are not exactly speedy weeknight meals so I don't expect them to get much traction lol. I love your changes! I can't believe I never thought to add orange zest to this, sounds wonderful.
See what other Food52ers are saying.